Does Target sell the most irresponsible homeopathic remedy ever?

I can’t think of anything more appalling than selling water to someone and telling them it will treat their asthma. This pic via Ryan Melyon on Twitter, was taken at a Target pharmacy in Chicago:

Fake asthma remedy

I’ve said it before but it’s worth repeating: Homeopathy is an elaborate placebo system where the “remedies” are inert. It’s reckless endangerment of life to sell a product for treating the acute symptoms of asthma when there is no medication in the bottle, even if there is a caution on the front of the box. And it should be obvious, but placebo has no meaningful effects in the treatment of asthma.  The sale of homeopathy in pharmacies is not only misleading to consumers, it is fundamentally unethical behavior from a health professional. Target and its pharmacists have a ethical and moral responsibility to pull this product off the shelf immediately.

January 16: Here’s an update on Target’s fake asthma “remedy”. And a petition has been started asking Target to stop selling this product.

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138 thoughts on “Does Target sell the most irresponsible homeopathic remedy ever?

  1. I couldn’t agree more–that this must be removed from shelves–but how to achieve that? I can write, but 100 homeopaths will counter that I am one-sided science-y smarty-pants, and demand their own “health freedom” to choose. Target management, being as scientifically illiterate as the rest of the population, will likely decide to “let people decide for themselves”.

    If you disagree or have an idea for some type of organized action, please let me know.

    • People confuse “rights” with “liberties”. While one may feel they have civil liberties to choose which medicine (or placebo) they use, they actually, in many cases, don’t have the right to do so. One does not have the right to withhold appropriate treatment from an ill child. This homeopathic “remedy” , essentially water like all homeopathic remedies, can endanger asthmatics by pretending to be appropriate asthma treatment. These should be banned by law.

      • This product contains those remedies most often used to treat asthma and will, as the box states, provide temporary relief in many cases. People with asthma wanting to be treated more deeply — and quite possibly cured — would consult with a homeopath who will prescribe the one remedy most suited to the patient.

        Since 1990 at least 17 high quality studies published in respected, peer-reviewed journals have shown that homeopathy is very effective in treating asthma and allergies.

        This is one of them. It showed significant positive changes from baseline to four weeks in the homeopathy group. No subject reported adverse effects.

        Annals of Pharmacotherapy, 2005 39:617 -624

        Additionally see “Homeopathy and respiratory allergies – a series of 147 cases” – “Allergies, especially respiratory allergies (which cause asthma) are one of the indications for which homeopathy treatments is most frequently sought. The progress of 147 cases of respiratory allergy (seen) in private homeopathic practice is reported here. Only TWO cases of ear, nose and throat (ENT) allergies out of a total of 105 showed no improvement. No patients deteriorated.”

        http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16569621

        And:

        “We’ve found homeopathy to have a greater than 90% effectiveness rate in curing hay fever. It often does not come back the following year if the person is receiving constitutional homeopathic care.”

        http://www.healthy.net/Health/Article/A_Quintuplet_of_Hay-Fever_Cases/641

    • One of the brags about homoeopathy is that the remedies are individually selected after consultation with the patient, not handed over impersonally as a “one size fits all” soul-less package from BigPharma.

      What I’m seeing here (looking at a picture of the ingredients from elsewhere) is a conglomeration of things that sound like they would work, and a couple that were used in mainstream medicine until they were superseded by more effective things.

      … but it’s all bippity-boppity-boo and not medicine.

    • The FDA approved homeopathic medicines for OTC sales in 1938 in recognition of their overwhelming safety record as used in hundreds of millions of people and spanning 200 years — something which cannot be said for conventional drugs.

      The HPUS (Homeopathic Pharmacopoeia of the United States) includes provisions for testing new remedies and verifying their clinical effectiveness.

      healing.about.com/od/homeopathy/a/homeopathy_fact_4.htm

      “However, if a product is a homeopathic drug, is subject to valid homeopathic proving (of efficacy as a homeopathic product), is compliant with all drug labeling requirements, is from an FDA registered drug establishment, and is listed as required by FDA regulations, it can be marketed in the U.S. without FDA approval.”

      http://www.fdaimports.com/industries/drugs/otc_homeopathic.php

      Conventional drugs cause at least 100,000 American deaths every year. Serious adverse drug reactions are the third leading cause of death annually in the U.S. ADR’s caused 2 million hospitalizations in the U.S. in 1994 alone and have cost the U.S. health care system more than $150 BILLION each year. 19 drugs have been withdrawn from the market since 1998. 26% of drugs introduced between 1980 and 2006 carry black box warnings (meaning use at YOUR OWN RISK).

      How is that “medicine”?

      Source: FDA/CDER/PhRMA/AASLD Meeting “Detecting and Investigating Drug Inducted Adverse Events, The International Adverse Event Consortium’s Experience to Date”, March, 2008

      • It’s medicine because it works. How many diseases has a homeopathic treatment cured? None! There’s nothing harmful in a homeopathic treatment precisely because there’s NOTHING in there besides water, or sugar (or alcohol), depending on the preparation.

      • Pharmacy Customer……

        This response is not for you since you’ve made up your mind about homeopathy without learning about it or trying it.

        This response is for people who want SAFE, non-toxic, effective medicine that’s also inexpensive and green.

        Homeopathy is famous for its cures of chronic diseases like type 2 diabetes, diseases considered incurable by con med. To see hundreds of contemporary cured case records of diseases from cancer to coma to gangrene to addiction to Rx drugs to psychogenic diabetes mellitus google “homeopathy cured cases”.

        In addition to contemporary cases there are 25,000 — twenty-five thousand — volumes of cured case records spanning almost 250 years.

  2. Homeopathic medicine is absolutely not an “elaborate placebo system.” Unless you consider cancer radiation a placebo effect? That one line makes me wonder how much else of this article is a lie. I don’t see anything on the package saying that it contains only water. It somewhat looks like it, but since you lied about what homeopathy is (plus the fact that using water instead of medicine isn’t homeopathy) I don’t really believe you.

    • At the concentrations typically used for a homeopathic preparation, it is statistically improbable that any of the listed ingredients remain at a sufficient level to have any effect. Furthermore, the methods used to determine what ingredients to use in a given preparation are pseudo-scientific at best. There is no plausible mechanism by which the principles of homeopathy could function, and every well controlled trial shows that it does not perform better than a placebo for treatment of symptoms.

      I think the description “elaborate placebo system” is appropriate. “Scam” might be better if you don’t assume good intentions. But I’d love to hear what you think is a better description and how you justify it.

      • I think my main problem with the description is that it lumps all homeopathic medicine together. I don’t support most homeopathic medicine and I’m afraid that’s how I’m coming off. Most of the time it’s bogus, and yes, essentially water.
        By definition, though, homeopathic medicine isn’t an elaborate placebo system. It’s based on the idea that “like cures like” and small amounts of what causes an illness can cure it. That’s all. So yeah, these dilutions are pretty inert as medicine, but that doesn’t mean homeopathy in general is an elaborate placebo system. There are some homeopathic methods that are still widely used in medical practice and DO have significant effects.

      • Can you actually name a valid medical practice that was discovered by the traditional proofing method used to pick homeopathic remedies? Hint: radiation oncology does not count, since it’s use has no ties to homeopathic proofing, and it is not used in homeopathic remedies. Its methodology of treatment is not “like cures like”. The directed radiation will kill healthy cells just as effectively as the cancerous ones. The trick is to focus it such that it kills more cancerous cells than healthy ones.

      • @PharmacyStudent
        “By definition, though, homeopathic medicine isn’t an elaborate placebo system. It’s based on the idea that “like cures like” and small amounts of what causes an illness can cure it.”

        Close “like cures like” is indeed homeopathy but not just small amounts, “infinitesimally” small amount. So small, in fact that nothing but water exists after the dilution. This is not typical placebo, aka sugar pill, but it is the same placebo effect. So I will say “elaborate placebo system” is wholly appropriate IF this product contains just water, which it should by definition that it says “homeopathy” on the front cover.

    • The principles of homeopathy are:
      1. Treat symptoms with a substance that causes those same symptoms.
      2. The more an ingredient is diluted (“proofed”), the more effective it becomes.
      The former is not the same as vaccination, which specifically triggers an immune response by injecting the patient with killed or weakened virus or bacteria so that the body recognizes those proteins and builds up defenses to them.
      As for radiation treatment for cancer, it is a known fact that radiation destroys cells. It doesn’t take much research at all to confirm that fact. Therefore, it stands to reason that directing radiation at tumor cells will kill them. The challenge is to spare as much healthy tissue as possible.

      As for the second principle, where else does diluting an ingredient, possibly even to the point of no molecules left in the solution, increase its strength?

    • //I don’t see anything on the package saying that it contains only water//

      That’s because the packaging is totally misleading. If you dilute a substance in water, so many times that you’re lucky if there’s a single molocule of said substance remaining, then what you’re left with is water. Water with nothing else in it is water. It’s as simple as that. These charlatans are selling water, but pretending that it is medicine. And that’s fraud.

      //but since you lied about what homeopathy is//

      No, they didn’t. Homeopathy lies about what homeopathy is.

      //plus the fact that using water instead of medicine isn’t homeopathy//

      That’s exactly what it is, except that homeopaths won’t admit this Homeopaths sell water, but claim that it is medicine. Therefore, they ARE selling water instead of medicine.

    • //By definition, though, homeopathic medicine isn’t an elaborate placebo system. It’s based on the idea that “like cures like” and small amounts of what causes an illness can cure it. That’s all//

      No, that’s not all, and that’s not the definition of homeopathy. Yes, “like cures like” is one of the foundations of homeopathy, but homeopathy is much more than this. It is not homeopathy until the so-called active ingredient has been diluted in water (commonly until you would be lucky to find one remaining molocule of the “active ingredient” left), and shaken.

      The three core tennets of homeopathy are
      1) The Law of Similars (“like cures like”)
      2) The Law of Infinitesimals (the nonsensical idea that the more you dilute something, the stronger it gets)
      3) The Law of Succussion (the idea that shaking the solution makes it even stronger)

      It’s all nonsense. I invite you to read the following webpage.

      http://www.1023.org.uk/what-is-homeopathy.php

    • You idiot. Homeopathic remedies are (in theory) substances thought to have some health benefit diluted with water to infinitesimally small quantities.

      Are you a pharmacy student? Doubt it

    • @Pharmacy Student: you say “there are some homeopathic methods that are still widely used in medical practice and DO have significant effects.”

      Please provide a reference to a well-controlled study, published in a peer-reviewed journal, that shows *any* homeopathic remedy to have “significant effects”.

    • Please identify the school where you are studying, they are feeding you ludicrous nonsense. Anybody who is teaching that homeopathy is in any way similar to radiotherapy, has no idea what they are talking about and no place in an institution of learning.

    • “There are some homeopathic methods that are still widely used in medical practice and DO have significant effects.”

      That’s news to me, can you name some of them?

  3. Anyone remember Hydrox from the IT miniseries? Water with a squirt of camphor to make it taste like medicine? Yeah, wow.
    A little depressed about the “Pharmacy Student” above, I hope they do some more reading.

  4. The “homeopathic” methods described on the quackwatch article you posted aren’t the methods used by health professionals today. The “placebo” deal you’re describing is allowed by the FDA and not really Target’s fault, it’s the fault of people that believe the memory of a substance is still in a liquid diluted so far that it’s no longer chemically there… However, homeopathic medicine IS still relevant in some cases, as in cancer radiation (which I mentioned before) and allergy shots. Both are dangerous and conditional, but certainly not placebos. Homeopathic medicine isn’t, by nature, a placebo effect. Stating so makes me disbelieve this article.

    • You know what, no that’s completely asinine. They are the ones who choose to carry the product. It is their fault they have it in their stores. Nobody forces them to carry it. They choose to. Because they know the ignorant will pay for it and they prize money over duty.

      Pharmacists and pharmacies, in big box stores or no, should have a professional responsibility to carry and promote only those treatments that actually have evidence behind them, just like doctors. To do any less is to rip people off.

      That the FDA doesn’t prohibit it doesn’t mean it’s an okay thing to do. By that logic, someone acting like a jerk isn’t at for being a jerk because being a jerk isn’t illegal.

    • You keep repeating that radiation therapy (and now allergy shots) are homeopathic remedies. Please stop trying to advance this horrible misinformation, and educate yourself as to how these therapeutic measures *actually* work. The idea that you’re a pharmacy student is quite troubling, given your lack of understanding of clinical medicine.

  5. It would be very interesting to know what sort of school “pharmacy student” attends. Certainly something big is missing in the curriculum.

  6. Sure, cancer radiation can be considered a type of homeopathic medicine. Radiation widely causes cancer, and professionals turn around and use small amounts of it to kill off cancer cells. That’s the basic definition of what homeopathy is. Is it what you think of? No, but it’s still the idea behind homeopathy.

    • No. Convoluting radition treatment with homeopathy is simply bizarre at best. There’s a fair link above that explores the reality of homeopathy. It’s quite scary to see someone who may be in a position to recommend such things to customers in the future defend such a scam product. Your customers depend on you to be knowledgable and ethical. Your stance here appears to be neither.

      • I’m not defending the product, I’m outraged at how homeopathy was defined. I never said anything about this particular product, really.

    • The effect of radiation does not magically reverse based on whether or not the patient is sick. A cancer patient and a healthy person both have the same negative side effects if exposed to radiation therapy, similar to a surgeon’s knife carrying the same risk whether surgery is needed or not.

      But perhaps you think a scalpel in the ER is no different from a dagger to the chest, other than not pushing so hard, and you think that also justifies homeopathy.

    • Not at all the same thing. In fact, quite the opposite. Large doses of radiation don’t cause cancer, they kill. Small amounts of radiation can cause tumors by damaging DNA. Radiation treatment is not “small doses of radiation”, it is doses of radiation large enough to kill cells, but directed as closely as posible at the tumor cells to kill them without harming healthy tissue. The comparison to homeopathy is patently absurd.

    • Are you eight? Have you graduated high school? Honestly, Pharmacy Student, you need to get a basic education–sadly, and no insult meant, you do not understand even very basic principles of clear thinking.

    • That is NOT what homoeopathy is. It’s not just treating like with like; it is treating like with like, diluted to zero using a magical shaking technique, turned into a sugar pill that doesn’t contain a single active molecule of the ‘like’ and fed to people as real medicine.

      Anyway, your analogy is terrible. Radiation can CAUSE cancer, it is not LIKE cancer. When was cancer like a load of particles that may also travel as waves? Were there a bunch of disembodied tumours hanging about Nagasaki? Do cosmologists look for the Cosmic Background Melanoma?

    • That is possibly the poorest understanding of radiation therapy I’ve ever seen; you clearly have no idea what you’re talking about.
      You also conveniently left out the part of the definition of homeopathy that claims that the smaller the dose (even past dilutions of 10^-40), the bigger the therapeutic effect, yet another outright fabrication based on no evidence whatsoever.

    • Oh come on, with that reasoning you might as well claim that stitching up the wounds of a stab victim is homeopathy – a big metal sharp thing (the kinfe) inserted into somebody causes the problem, while a small metal sharp thing (the needle used in stitching) inserted helps heal it.

      You see how ridiculous this is? Clearly neither this nor radiation treatment acts on the principle that ‘like cures like’ – they may coincidentally be alike, but neither radiation nor wound stitching is judged to work *because* they are like the condition.

  7. Pharmacy Student: You seem to have inaccurate definition of homeopathy, and, thus, you are convoluting non-homeoathic treatments with homeopathy, which is a pre-scientific notion, made up out of thin air, basically. It would do you some good to pull back and take a much longer look at the matter.

    • Look, I never said that I would recommend homeopathy or this product in particular (I don’t know anything about this product and it looks pretty sketchy). The only thing I took issue with was how homeopathy was defined. It was not made just to be a placebo effect even though that’s how many homeopathic “medicines” are today. The idea behind homeopathy is different from that, and occasionally, it’s medically relevant.

      • Though, I do think I made an error today. The classical definition of homeopathy and the common definition today aren’t the same. They hardly teach much on homeopathy since it’s mostly irrelevant.

      • I’m not sure if you have a natural products course in your curriculum or not, but your definition of homeopathy is wrong. Not everything that appears to be “like-curing-like” is a homeopathic treatment.

        In Canada, homeopathic substances must be defined in a homeopathic pharmacopoeia and the product must be prepared as per the homeopathic pharmacopoeia.

        In Canada, the following cannot claim to be natural health products (including homeopathic treatments): radiopharmaceuticals, biologics (actual vaccines), antibiotics, tobacco products, injectable products, controlled drugs or substances, prescription medications, conventional over-the-counter medications, medical devices, cosmetics, foods, and drug products for animals.

        TL;DR: If it’s not prepared according to a homeopathic pharmacopoeia, it isn’t a homeopathic product. “Homeopathic” hasn’t become a broad term that can be applied to many products; homeopathic medications take a substance and dilute it until the chance of finding a molecule of that substance in the final product practically becomes zero.

        There’s no active ingredient in homeopathic products, thus they are basically placebo products. Recommending a bottle of water in place of a homeopathic product would be 1) cheaper and 2) just as efficacious.

        This Quackwatch article (http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/homeo.html) explains homeopathy as it is practiced today, for future reference.

  8. @Pharmacy Student: you wrote
    “Homeopathy] is based on the idea that “like cures like” and small amounts of what causes an illness can cure it. That’s all.”

    OK, that’s an “idea,” or perhaps a hypothesis. An unproven one. Hippocrates, who’s often quoted as having said the like cures like, believed in the four humors. There is as much evidence for that hypothesis as there is for homeopathy. Direct us to the studies that demonstrate the “like cures like,” and that the less of a “remedy” you give, the more potent its effect before you call the OP a lie.

    If homeopathy works, everything we know about chemistry, physics and pharmacology is wrong. Everything.

    • ‘ “[Homeopathy] is based on the idea that “like cures like” and small amounts of what causes an illness can cure it. That’s all.”

      OK, that’s an “idea,” or perhaps a hypothesis. An unproven one.’

      But…isn’t that what flu shots, allergy treatment, vaccines of all sorts are based on?

      • No. Vaccinations work because they trigger the immune system to develop the antibodies necessary to defeat the disease. The disease becomes recognizable to the body by the introduction of the “trial dose” that vaccinations provide. If “like cures like”, you would give the flu shot when you have already gotten the flu, the polio vaccine when you are already crippled, the smallpox vaccine when you are spotted, etc. That’s just not the way it works. I remember learning all this in the 5th or 6th grade back in the 1950-60s — clearly our educational system has regressed.

      • No. Homeopathy is based on the premise that diluting a substance over and over again, well past the point that it is impossible for even a single molecule of the original substance to remain in the solution makes the “remedy” more powerful with each dilution.

        Vaccines and allergy desensitization treatments are based on an understanding of how the immune system works and the effects are verified through scientific trials. Homeopathy is based on a belief in magic. Oh, and there is actually something IN vaccines and allergy shots.

        (For some reason Twitter is not letting me post again as DragonCalf)

      • Nope.

        Flu shots and vaccines are based on the idea “if you teach your body to be ready to kill it, then when a real virus comes, it will meet it’s death.” Allergy treatment is based on the idea “if you teach your body to react less to a small amount, it will react less to a large amount.”

        “Like cures like” would be “when you’re having an allergic reaction to plant pollen, just go inhale a little more, and you’ll magically convince your body to stop having this reaction”.

        As you can see, those are two different methods. The first is the scientific-medical one, the second is the homeopathic.

      • “Like cures like” only refers to the symptoms of the ailment, not the ailment itself. And it is a patently nonsensical idea.
        For example, a runny nose and streaming eyes are symptoms of having a cold. They are also a symptom of chopping up onions. So ultra dilute onion would be a remedy for the symptoms of a cold. If you display the symptoms of a cold (irrespective of the pathology of your disease) a homeopath should give you (sell you) sugar pills imagined to have been exposed to a solution of a substance that causes the same symptoms, diluted – 1 part water to 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001 part “substance”. That would be a 30C dilution, which is if I may say highly dangerous in untrained hands… apparently.

        Homeopathy pre-dates germ theory. It is incontrovertibly medical fraud, and anyone aware of how homeopathy is made, and what it actually is, who says otherwise either shouldn’t be allowed to run any aspect of their life without supervision or is a congenital liar.

  9. Sharing this post has sparked a lot of dialogue on my social media. I’m wondering if anyone can share a photo of the ingredients for my friends who aren’t familiar with homeopathy’s dilution scheme and want to see it for themselves on this product? I tried googling and couldn’t find this product let alone its ingredients. Thanks so much for all you do!

      • Could you post a link to the pic of the ingredients? Cos I’m curious too if they’re accurately using the term homeopathic. I would assume they’re selling a menthol spray with actual amounts of menthol and it got labeled homeopathic cos someone thought that meant ‘natural medicine’ or something.

    • Absolutely.

      I took this photo at my local Target today: http://i.imgur.com/0xEWows.jpg

      Under “Drug Facts” on the back is a long list of “HPUS (Homeopathic Pharmacopia Convention of the United States) active ingredients”. Beneath that, it reads “Equal volumes of each ingredient in 10X, 30X and LM1 potencies.” Don’t be fooled by “10X” or “30X”. These “potencies” are SO diluted that they contain virtually NO traces of any of these ingredients. How dilute are we talking about? 8X is the allowable concentration of ARSENIC in U.S. drinking water. At 26X, there are NO molecules of the original solution present.

      The side of the box boasts “There are no known negative side effects or drug interactions.” That’s because there’s NOTHING there for another medication to interact with.

      It’s quackery, pure and simple. At least the Target I photographed this at today had it marked down to 6.99, but even then, it’s snake-oil chicanery at best.

  10. ‘like cures like’? so, you treat AIDS with AIDS? Herpes with Herpes? When I get a headache, I don’t hit myself in the head, I take an aspirin, which is not like a headache. Memory in water? Well, I have swam in three different Oceans, does that make me cured for life? Not a fan of the AMA, but I do find homeopathic & holistic medicine dubious. I actually work for several alternative medicine Dr.’s & when I got a small chunk of metal lodged in my hand, they gave me Silica to expel it? WTF?? Like, cut the damn thing out!!

    • Homeopathy is the absolute antithesis of a holistic treatment. It is an idea, long discredited, based on the symptoms of whatever ails the patient and has nothing whatever to do with the pathology of it.
      The homeopathic theory of disease pre-dates germ theory. According to homeopathy all disease is caused by miasms. As a system of medicine it is almost certainly less valid than “eye of newt, leg of toad, tongue of snake, lips of chicken… sprinkled with fairy dust… say magic words…”, which at least contains some ingredients other than water and sugar.

    • Dehydration?

      Although some remedies may actually work. The dog boarder recommended a homeopathic product for treating our dogs fear of thunderstorms; she also said to ignore the directions, don’t give him a few drops, give him a good belt of it. It was labelled 30C, so I figured no possible way it could do anything. Then I looked at the ingredients. The dilutant was not pure water, it was actually about 40 proof. So yeah, it could work, but it’d be cheaper giving the dog a shot of vodka. But then again, the true active ingredient wasn’t what was on the front label.

  11. I just checked my nearest Tarzhay and it’s marked down to $6.99. Looks like a closeout to me, which would be good news. The ingredient list is incomprehensible to me, and I’ve untangled a fair amount of homeopathic twaddle.

    “Equal volumes of each ingredient in 10X, 30X and LM1 potencies.” 10X = 1:10 billion dilution. 30X is well beyond the Avogadro limit, and (learned something today!) LM1 = 1:50,000. In other words, this product is like making love in a canoe. (If you don’t know the joke, Google it)

  12. Everyone’s views on homeopathy aside, the law states to make a claim to treat an illness you must be a drug IE proven to work on that illness. Legally I believe all they can say is something “watered down” like “supports a healthy respiratory system” all natural medicine, unless proven to the USFDA with USFDA standards and all the fees required, they fall under the category of foods. So like milk “does a body good” and can never say they prevent osteoporosis, this is quite illegal and yes, irresponsible.

  13. Oh my god. This is absolutely HORRIFYING. I’m so glad my parents are scientifically literate, and made sure to get me for real treatment when I began presenting with asthma symptoms.

  14. How is this reckless and endangerment? The box is CLEARLY marked “Homeopathic” and “NOT A RESCUE INHALER”! Everyone just FuckingReacts and act all appalled. What about learning to read the labels and know what you are buying? This is not a placebo inhaler.

  15. are homeopathic remedies sometimes FDA approved? or are they regulated like supplements (that is, virtually unregulated)? if the latter, then how are they able to make what appear to be explicit claims of efficacy for treating symptoms of asthma? don’t you need to prove safety and efficacy to make claims like that?

    • I think homeopathy is excluded from both FDA and the Supplement Act by some old law from the 30’s. You can find more details at sciencebasedmedicine.org if you use the search box. Also, Quackwatch might have more details–sorry I can’t be more specific off the top of my head.

  16. I would totally agree that this shouldn’t be sold, however its appears to be a fake picture, as no such Up&Up product exists. They do have a product with medicine in it for allergies and asthma (but that is obviously different than what is suggested here.) If a story sounds crazy please research it before spreading false info! Lastly all the sources mentioned in the article are from the same person on the same site (should be a red flag.)

  17. Such an interesting conversation to read through.

    FIrst, tell me what is so seriously bad about a placebo effect (which is WELL documented)? If someone can cure them-self because they believe they can, ah, where is the harm there. And, then if the placebo effect is a valid option, then certainly there is no harm here.

    Second, the critical factor here is not about all the like-cures-like stuff. Homeopathy is an energy medicine. The energy potentializes the remedy.

    Homeopathy is so far beyond what it started out as, and really, if it was all such crap, why is it the method of choice in so many places in the world, besides the US where the FDA (run by former C-levels from major pharmaceutical companies, and which apparently has alot of trouble finding out about serious drug side effects until WELL after they have caused thousands of people damage and are about to have their patent expire), and why does it work on animals and non-believers alike?

    Some of you should read history books and find out really why the AMA was started. While people believe it was initiated for better medicine, that could not be further from the truth. Turns out it was to discredit and demean homeopaths. Much like the push against hemp because it would harm established industries worth booko bucks, the same is true for the AMA. They banded together to PROTECT themselves.

    I have had two significant homeopaths work with my family, and my pets. Of course, as I am not a physician, all my observations are anecdotal, but when watched my cat on deaths door perk up and purr only minutes after receiving a remedy (over 20 years ago now), I was sold. I saw similar immediate changes with my children. So you know you can argue as long as you want, but placebo effect or not, it is amazing.

    BTW, if you cannot believe in homeopathy, then you really cannot believe in the warmth of the sun, the life of the air we breath, the god particle, or any of that stuff cuz it’s all energy baby! all energy. While everyone gives credit to Edison, the real hero was Tesla who had such a profound relationship with electrical energy that he was years and years and years ahead of his time. We are just beginning to see that he really was on to something. My humble opinion that much of real science is stiffled by people who want the experiments to just create stuff for them to sell.

    but, this is all just for my own benefit. given that most of our media and what people “know” is controlled by a handful of super-large companies, no one wants to open their mind to the possibility of this.

    • Your utter and complete ignorance of chemistry might explain why you are capable of such “faith” in homeopathy. Energy…? Hogwash. You might as well say “Magic!”, seeing as how you don’t really seem to understand what energy is.

      The crux of this matter is that asthma is not relieved by inhaling water, or any placebo effect related with doing so, therefore selling such a product is reprehensible as it could lead to the deaths of innocent people. Are you really defending this?
      You present no evidence for your claims and freely admit that your claims are anecdotal, so what is it you hope to achieve by speaking your mind?

      Oh, and ending it all with a nice little dose of conspiracy theory is just swell. You’re a lost cause, aren’t you?

      Why do I even bother…

      • Wow my utter lack of knowledge of chemistry. I was a chemistry AND biology major in college. Oh and classics for a triple. Guess I have no idea. But you all rock on with the poisons. When others are dying of Mara and other complications of overused chemicals I will have a chance.

    • The fact that you actually said “cuz it’s all energy baby” further demonstrates that you don’t understand clinical medicine or the (irrational) concept behind homeopathy, regardless of your educational background.

    • These homeopathic remedies have been available over-the-counter for 200 years. I’m sure they will continue to be available for those who want to try them in addition to their regular health protocol, as most people try homeopathy after all else fails. People must remain free to make their own choices in life and investigate, as they already do, the benefits and down sides of all medications and drugs they put into their body.

    • Based on your study of chemistry and biology in college, can you explain precisely *what* type of energy exists in homeopathic medicines? Can you explain what the effect is left in the water?

      The problem with the placebo effect is that very few, if any, real illnesses lend themselves any placebo effect? Would you prescribe a placebo for a gunshot wound? How about for cancer? Or what about those parents who forgo medical treatment for a child in favor of prayer? Do you remember Laetrile from the 1970s? It was touted as a cure for cancer. A couple from Boston took their child to Mexico for Laetrile treatment instead of chemotherapy. He died, of course. So much for the placebo effect.

  18. Interesting comments. I hope you all are as careful with vaccinations contents. I’m not going to even try to convince any of you of anything because I don’t even know this product but…the only medical doctor in all of history in America to have a monument built honoring his work is Samuel Hahnemann…the founder of Homeopathy. It resides in Washington DC and was rededicated in 2001 I believe…full color guard and all the military trimmings. Perhaps one of you bright light bulbs should let the government know that they are all idiots (hmmmmmm) and that they should listen to you! Seriously I don’t mean to offend but you don’t know what you don’t know and as bright as I’m sure you all are, there is plenty more to learn in this life..

    • And we all know monuments are better than scientific evidence, right? Homeopathy works because you believe it works, right?
      I doubt you’ll find much respect for such ignorant beliefs around here, miss.

    • I don’t know if you saw the recent news that polio is on the verge of being eradicated worldwide. It’s not homeopathy that accomplished that, it’s vaccines.
      And what does having a monument erected have anything to do with whether something is actually true?
      When if comes to allowing the snake oil of homeopathy to be sold, and not allowing the FDA to regulate them the way all other medicines are regulated, the government ARE idiots.

  19. >And, then if the placebo effect is a valid option, then certainly there is no harm here.

    The placebo effect isn’t some magic solution, like just tricking yourself into healing. Athsma isn’t a headache. Distracting yourself from it will not make it better. No amount of “wishing the hurt away” is going to cause your airways to stop being inflamed and open up for you. So yes, there is absolutely harm if someone thinks this product is going to help them breath better when they’re having their airways constricted.

    >if you cannot believe in homeopathy, then you really cannot believe in the warmth of the sun, the life of the air we breath, the god particle….

    wat

  20. You know, I kind of hope it is just water! People need to wise up and realize that there are companies that are looking to make money off you. I hope none of you are surprised by this! It may be reckless of Target and whatever “Up and Up” is, but it’s also reckless of people who walk into a store and believe everything they read. This product would be discontinued and removed if people didn’t buy it. I too hope that someday we will live in a world where people are not exploited for their ignorance, but until then, look out for yourselves.

  21. Maybe we’re all irresponsible. No matter what I post I’m going to get told I’m wrong just like everyone else has, so I’m just going to say it. I’m asthmatic. I use my nebs like I’m supposed to because I know what happens when I don’t. Is it irresponsible or “reckless” of Target and stores like Target to be selling stuff like this one their shelves? Maybe and maybe not. People need to be responsible enough to know that when they read a box that says “this is not a rescue inhaler” it’s probably not going to help them if they are having symptoms. Most asthmatics carry their rescue inhalers [or in my case, my portable neb] with them at all times just in case they are needed. You can’t blame Target for “making” them buy this product anymore than you can blame them for “making” them buy a certain brand of Kleenex because it’s got lotion it in, for example or a certain brand of cough drops because they have menthol, for example. These things probably aren’t any better than their competition, but if we’ve been TOLD that they’re better and BELIEVE that they’re better, that’s what we’re going to buy. [Kind of a placebo effect??]

    Anyway, I guess what I’m trying to say is that we have to be our own advocates and use common sense. Most people are smart enough to know that if it says it’s not a rescue inhaler, don’t expect to use it as one.

  22. Selling such a product is gravely unethical. If someone tried to sell you any OTHER kind of product that had a) so little chance of doing what it promises and b) so little chance that you would be able to detect the product’s limits, you would call it *fraud*.

  23. This makes me so angry! Being a pediatric pulmonary nurse I have never seen something so bogus in my life. You people arguing about homeopathic or not…WHO CARES bottom line people are going to die if they choose to use this instead of their actual medicine. While it does say does not replace your rescue inhaler..which I am sure is how they are getting away with it, the symptoms they claim to relive is WHEN YOU NEED your rescue inhaler. It’s just sad that people are going to buy into this and suffer from it.

  24. I never understand why it’s legal to list as active ingredients substances that (a) are potentially toxic and (b) aren’t actually contained in the product.

  25. First, what does someone do when they can’t afford medical insurance (even with Obamacare) or who don’t qualify for any free programs? In the event of a bad financial month or a bad several months where they can’t afford an inhaler (they’re around $60 for cash payments), perhaps something such as what Target offers would be better than nothing at all. Please note that I am just playing devil’s advocate.

    Second, there are real medical doctors who believe in and use Homeopathy. It’s not all bippity boppity or rubbish according to them. In 2013 I met a medical doctor (Dr. Lauren Feder) who successfully uses homeopathy and she also believes in and uses traditional western medicine.

    When my daughter was born, she had an eye infection that wouldn’t go away. At first I and her doctor thought it was that common infection that babies get from blocked tear ducts. At another check-up, her doctor decided to test it. It took a week to get the results back and when my doctor received them it was late on a Friday. She said my daughter had an infection that wasn’t common at all in a baby and that the most common antibiotics wouldn’t work to heal the infection. She said she would need to consult with a pediatric eye specialist to see which antibiotic to prescribe.

    I looked up the infection name online, and found out some scary things – the worst being my little one could end up partially or fully blind in that eye. So rather than waiting until the next week to find out what antibiotics I should buy, I borrowed a homeopathic book from a friend. I read through several different eye infection symptoms and matched a set of symptom descriptions with what was occurring with her eye. I bought the recommended homeopathic remedy (Pulsatilla), and administered it to my daughter as recommended in the book. (Have you ever seen those blue vials from Boiron at a health food store? Yeah, it was one of those that I purchased). After giving my daughter this remedy for 2 days, the eye infection cleared up completely. 100% gone. She was an infant. There was no way she could have any “belief” in the product and be healed through the placebo effect. I had no previous experience with homeopathic remedies. I did not believe one way or the other – I was just trying to do something that MIGHT work while I waited for her doctor to get back to me about which antibiotics to purchase. Did my semi-belief somehow act as a placebo for her? I doubt it.

    I took my baby to the doctor the next week who checked her eye and could clearly see the infection was 100% gone. This was an infection that SHOULD NOT HAVE CLEARED UP WITHOUT ANTIBIOTICS. But it did. Her doctor said Pulsatilla has been around for a long time and did not at all poo poo the idea that it cured her.

    You can come to whatever conclusion you like. But I am convinced the Pulsatilla healed her. This does not mean I suddenly become all crunchy mama who only believes in healing her child with natural means. I believe in doctors and western medicine. But I also now believe in homeopathy.

    I have a brother who has asthma – he’s had it all his life. I have seen him go through hard times and not be able to afford an inhaler. He can clearly read a box and see that something says, “Not a rescue inhaler”. But if he couldn’t afford a $60 inhaler, would he be wrong or irresponsible or stupid for purchasing the $6 item and trying it out?

    • I’m happy to hear that your child’s infection cleared up without further complications. You are lucky. But your anecdotal example does not prove the efficacy of homeopathic remedies. At best, it would warrant an in-depth, controlled study. But those studies have been done already. Repeatedly. And they show that homeopathy does not work. It is much more likely that, in your case, the infection simply cleared up on its own. That happens all the time. It’s also possible that it was mis-diagnosed. That happens too.

      “I have a brother who has asthma – he’s had it all his life. I have seen him go through hard times and not be able to afford an inhaler. He can clearly read a box and see that something says, “Not a rescue inhaler”. But if he couldn’t afford a $60 inhaler, would he be wrong or irresponsible or stupid for purchasing the $6 item and trying it out?”

      The people who buy these products are not the ones who are irresponsible or wrong. The people who produce and sell them are. Your brother should be able to walk into a pharmacy and trust that whatever he purchases is actually a useful and effective treatment for the symptoms it claims to treat. Instead, there are any number of companies who are willing to sell you sugar pills and pretend that they are medecine. And the local pharmacy is happy to place them right there with the real medicine. I was horrified last week when I went to the local Safeway to get my wife some decongestant. The entire top row of the cold medicine aisle was occupied with homeopathic remedies, Airborne (they were fined millions by the FDA for lying about their efficacy), and zinc tablets (some early studies showed promise on this, but nobody has been able to reliably reproduce the results). It’s no mystery why this is the case. The profit margin on fake medicine is huge compared to real medicine. Especially when they don’t have to worry about any pesky oversight by the FDA.

      Since you asked, my advice to those who can’t afford actual medical care would be not to waste what little money you do have on stuff that isn’t going to help. False hope is not worth $6.

    • Good for you for doing your research on homeopathy and choosing a medical doctor who has added this form of health care to her practice! I’m reasonably certain that you also have read or purchased a few books about homeopathy and just may have a homeopathic first aid kit for your home. Conventional medicine is great for emergency care and life-saving surgery, but homeopathy is the best most effective non-toxic and inexpensive preventive care world-wide. It is no wonder that the World Health Organization has determined that homeopathy is the 2nd most used form of health care internationally. No longer the “medicine of Kings”, homeopathy in the 21st century is medicine for the common man!

      • JSug,

        In its 2003-4 report “Homeopathy: review and analysis of reports on controlled clinical trials” the WHO noted that the majority of peer-reviewed scientific papers over the past 40 years “…..have demonstrated that homeopathy is superior to placebo in placebo-controlled trials and is equivalent to conventional medicine in the treatment of illnesses in both humans and animals.” It also stated in its journal “The World Health Forum” that “Homeopathy seems well suited for use in rural areas where the infrastructure, equipment and drugs needed for conventional medicine cannot be provided.”

        http://www.health-e.org.za/news/article.php?uid=20031878

        WHO Bulletin 1999: Integrating Homeopathy in Health systems includes “Proposals for closer incorporation of homeopathy into Western medical systems”

        http://www.who.int/bulletin/archives/77(2)160.pdf

    • >>perhaps something such as what Target offers would be better than nothing at all.<<
      The problem is that there are no active ingredients.

      I feel for people who can't afford inhalers. My Ventolin is $43 and I have insurance, that's because (1) there aren't any generics now, and (2) OTC primatene (and related generics) are off the market. People with better insurance than mine pay less, but for me and for uninsured people, the only other options are the OTC nebulizers that are like $50 for a starter and hardly have enough to use them a few times (I think it's like 10 uses).

      I don't think anyone would blame the person without insurance willing to try anything because he or she was desperate, but the fact remains that there is no medicine in the "medicine," and that the packaging can be very misleading (esp. for someone who doesn't understand what homeopathy is or is not esp. scientifically-literate), so I'd still consider selling it to be vastly irresponsible, even deadly, because it is basically financially preying upon people who are sick, desperate, and maybe don't have a lot of money. So yes, I'd still blame the company selling it.

      As for the other story, it could be anything. Some things really do clear up without antibiotics, even something that may not seem likely to do so. Or it could be one of those remedies where they illegally put actual active ingredients in (one had peniccilin, I believe, but didn't list it). There are a number of variables and it's impossible to know for sure what happened. I'm glad it cleared up for her, but I'd also caution people about believing in a whole branch of unproven stuff because of one account that was not proven to be from that remedy.

  26. Urine was used in mainstream medicine until it was superseded by more effective things. that doesn’t make piss good for you, not should it be a legal ingredient. but with a growing contingent of whack jobs claiming that their belief should supersede scientific fact, and congressional shills blocking oversight so that corporations can commit fraud, we are left with
    bottled water passing as medication. and the FDA powerless to stop it. REGULATION DOES NOT PRECEDE FRAUD… IT FOLLOWS IT. But that is why republicans hate regulation. isnt it?

  27. This product is thankfully not in Canada (yet?). I’m a pharmacist in Target in Canada & if I came across such nonsense on the shelf, I’d be pulling it ASAP. It’s one thing to have the placebo (er, I mean homeopathic) stuff there for self limiting conditions where we don’t really have good options (cough and cold).. but asthma… really?
    This is another example of how pharmacies struggle to balance profits with healthcare ethics. Some could complain about corporations.. but I’ve seen just as many small shops selling out their ethics by selling snake oil products.

    • Even when you don’t have “good options”, how is defrauding the customer ever justified. Colds in particular are self limiting, and homeopathic preparations reduce the symptoms and duration of cold by exactly zero days. As they say, if left untreated your cold will be gone in two weeks – or in 14 days with homeopathy. Homeopathy is the worst of all medical scams because it is so plausible to the scientifically ignorant. There is never any justification for selling it.

      • Agreed. Homeopathy doesn’t have any chance of working & it is sad to see on pharmacy shelves. I subscribe to the argument that putting homeopathy on a pharmacy shelf lends credibility to the nonsense. The only way I see to get around this is to get a provincial or national ban in place. This may lead folks to the ‘natural’ store and where they are more likely to get less evidence based information. Maybe that’s better because it wouldn’t tarnish the reputation of a healthcare professional? Maybe it’s worse because we wouldn’t get to have a conversation with people about it as often.

        The issue I was raising is that other OTC products have the basically the same efficacy. Would you say that selling those is also fraud? — though they have a theoretical mechanism, if you look at the body of evidence behind them, they have been shown to be no better than placebo… I agree there is a difference. Homeopathy has no chance of working ever vs. several of the other OTC ingredients that have shown no positive outcomes. However, the end result of both is: no benefit over placebo to the patient.
        I give folks a good understanding of the lack of benefit of the products and some listen… some are just tired and want to take something/anything — regardless of the recommendations and information supplied. Informed decisions might be the best we can hope for.
        If you tell them it won’t work and they buy it anyway, that is not fraud. That has much to do with some peoples belief that taking something and hoping it will help is better than taking nothing and getting better.

  28. @JSug

    From the same article you mention, there is this: ” However Paula Ross, chief executive of the Society of Homeopaths, said it was right to raise concerns about promotion of homeopathy as a cure for TB, malaria or HIV and Aids.

    But she added: “This is just another poorly wrapped attempt to discredit homeopathy by Sense About Science.

    “The irony is that in their efforts to promote evidence in medicine, they have failed to do their own homework.

    “There is a strong and growing evidence base for homeopathy and most notably, this also includes childhood diarrhoea.”

    The UK’s Faculty of Homeopathy added that there was also evidence homeopathy could help people with seasonal flu.

    Dr Sara Eames, president of the faculty, said people should not be deprived of effective conventional medicines for serious disease.

    But she added: “Millions die each year as those affected have no access to these drugs.

    “It therefore seems reasonable to consider what beneficial role homeopathy could play. What is needed is further research and investment into homeopathy.”

    • I’m not sure what your point is. I think we can all agree that homeopaths believe there is evidence supporting the effectiveness of homeopathy. My point was that legitimate doctors and scientists, who have already done the research they are calling for, disagree with them.

      • “My point was that legitimate doctors and scientists, who have already done the research they are calling for, disagree with them.”

        You are implying that homeopaths are not legitimate doctors. There are one-half million homeopaths practicing around the world today. The majority of them are M.D.’s. Provide proof that they are not legitimate doctors.

        There are 309 studies published in 119 respected, national and international peer-reviewed journals showing homeopathy produces significant to substantial health benefits. Explain how these studies prove that homeopathy doesn’t work.

        Most homeopathic research is conducted by independent researchers with experience in CAM research so you are actually referring to independent research, not to research conducted by homeopaths who generally spend their time at their clinical practices. Provide proof that the people conducting CAM research are not legitimate scientists or researchers.

  29. People have as much right to buy bogus remedies as they do to worship (what other people consider) a bogus god. And let’s be honest. Nobody estimates that homeopathy kills more than 400,000 people a year in the U.S., as is the case with the medical cartel.

      • That’s exactly the problem with con med and one of the reasons so many people are turning to safe, effective, natural systems of medicine. In addition, conventional treatments are often dangerous, even lethal. That’s why so many conventional cough and cold treatments were taken off the market.

  30. A. Statistically Significant human studies upto the end of year 2010
    1. 309 studies published in 120 journals including 11 meta-analysis.
    2. 8 out of approx. 20 systematic reviews are in favour of homeopathy i.e. 40%
    3. 84 DBRPCT (out of approx. 225 RCT) are in evidence of homeopathy i.e. 37.34%

    B. Out of 164 high quality papers published between 1950-2011 (inclusive) on RCT in 89 medical conditions
    1. 137 are placebo-controlled & 27 other-than-placebo controlled studies
    2. 71 (43%) papers reported +ve findings, 9 (6%) were negative; 80 (49%) were non-conclusive; 4 (2%) contained non-extractable data.
    3. Out of 137 placebo-controlled studies, 41 are on individualised homeopathy and 96 on non-individualised homeopathy
    4. In 32 out of 89 disease conditions, there has been replicated research (2 or more RCT).
    5. In 22 out of 32 disease conditions, the results of replicated research were statistically significant.

    Check out the details at http://drnancymalik.wordpress.com

      • That’s a “skeptic” site run by people associated with conventional medicine. Naturally, it’s in their best interests to deny that other systems of medicine have validity.

      • By that logic, isn’t just as likely that “Dr. Nancy Malik” cherry-picked data to make her own point?

        Let’s be honest, if homeopathy worked, why doesn’t EVERYONE do it and recommend it and shout its virtues from the mountain tops? Here’s my answer: Credible scientists and researchers have studies the claims and they’ve found no merit.

      • Pharmacy customer:

        Dr. Malik isn’t discussing anything except homeopathic research. She isn’t cherry-picking studies on conventional medicine.

        You say “….if homeopathy worked why doesn’t EVERYONE use it….”. I could ask you the same question: “Why doesn’t everyone use con med?”
        Everyone doesn’t use con med for a number of reasons:

        Conventional drugs cure nothing.

        Conventional drugs create diseases in people who didn’t have them before they took the prescription.

        Adverse drug reactions are responsible for 100,000 American deaths every year. They are the third leading cause of death in the U.S. They caused over 2 million hospitalizations in 1994 alone. 19 drugs have been withdrawn from the market since 1998 for these reasons. 26% of drugs introduced between 1980 and 2006 in the U.S. carry black box warnings meaning “use at your own risk”.

        You apparently don’t know that homeopathy is the second most used system of medicine in the world today. Traditional Chinese Medicine is the most used, and con med is the THIRD most used. Its use is growing in countries around the world at annual rates of 10% to 30%.

        Provide clinical evidence that homeopathy doesn’t work. Provide proof — names, credentials, papers and where published — of these “credible scientists and researchers” who claim homeopathy doesn’t work.

  31. While I just scanned the comments – I am surprised no-one else mentioned the unit price… $127 a pint. For water. Even for bottled water, that’s a 13000% markup!

  32. Just saw this in my local Target store, for $15.47. I questioned the pharmacist about it and he stuck up for it, saying he “ex-terned” at a homeopathy clinic in his native South Africa and was surprised at the results.

    • @Pharmacy Customer I am sure that I can conclude that you have never been treated by a homeopath and/or your family homeopath has never suggested that you purchase a particular remedy after a consultation, right? Conclusion = you have no basis for your opinions about the effectiveness, or the cost, of a homeopathic remedy.

      • I wanted to consult a homeopath, but my insurance provider wouldn’t approve bogus treatments. Ok, that’s not true, but I couldn’t resist. I would never consult a homeopath.

        Here’s a serious question though, and I’m hoping that someone who’s well versed in homeopathy can answer.

        If I take a sample of a traditional medicine, generic ibuprofen, for example, I can send it unlabeled to a lab and they could analyze it, determine its ingredients, and tell me what the drug is. Can a lab do the same for a homeopathic preparation? Can they determine what ingredients were used and in what concentrations, and tell me what ailments it was intended to treat?

  33. It would be cool if someone would steal a bottle of this stuff and actually analyze it using gas spectrometry. Then once it’s proven that there are no molecules of some of the items on the label, then the FDA (as well as FTC) can shut down the company responsible for producing this fraudulent “cure.” I’ve never been in favor of big lawsuits, but I would enjoy an asthma patient suing these homeopathic frauds into bankruptcy.

    The sad thing is that there are people that actually believe this crap. They’re so worried about the so-called medical-industrial complex that their tin foil hats have allowed their brains to overheat, thus affecting judgement and reasoning. This is the same crowd that thinks vaccines cause autism despite the original research paper that started that hysteria being withdrawn as well as discredited. These same folks claim that global warming is “settled science” yet ignore the “settled” science that water and hyper dilutions of eye of newt aren’t going to cure colds.

    • Well, for this purpose, I would see nothing wrong with paying for a bottle, but your point is taken. If homeopathic medicine works, why doesn’t the industry should conduct some double blind studies to prove it? The only reason I can come up with is that there is no easy way to tell which is the actual drug and which is the placebo.

  34. Scott, I cannot find the answer to this question anywhere, so I’m hoping that you can enlighten me. Do you know why some “natural” products are sold as homeopathic medicine when it clearly doesn’t meet the definition where it is a “like” product that is so diluted that there’s practically nothing but water? And example would be Allergiemittel which is labeled as a natural allergy homeopathic medication. I’m sure it’s the same old bullshit, but to me it doesn’t even qualify as homeopathic.

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